Comments on: Milton Friedman on the Rise of Socialism in the U.S. http://www.cleverdude.com/content/milton-friedman-on-the-rise-of-socialism-in-the-us/ Family, Marriage, Finances & Life Sat, 11 Feb 2012 13:09:32 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: FreeTexas http://www.cleverdude.com/content/milton-friedman-on-the-rise-of-socialism-in-the-us/comment-page-1/#comment-73891 FreeTexas Thu, 06 May 2010 04:23:09 +0000 http://www.cleverdude.com/?p=1354#comment-73891 America needs to de-urbanize. Our urban centers are too large, and as a result compatition is harder for small companies, because there are more of them. If we produced more crops and became less dependent on foriegn crops we would see a rise in our economy. Crops are a renewable recorce that can be left unregulated fairley safely. And on the socialism-capitolism debate: in Russia in 1920 there was the worst famine in European history. Lennon enacted the "New Economic Policy" which de-socialized the farms of Russia. By 1927 Russia was the 5th largest EXPORTER of crops in the world. Let's learn from history. P.S.: Stalin actually killed all of the Russian farmers a fee years later because they were too "independent minded". America needs to de-urbanize. Our urban centers are too large, and as a result compatition is harder for small companies, because there are more of them. If we produced more crops and became less dependent on foriegn crops we would see a rise in our economy. Crops are a renewable recorce that can be left unregulated fairley safely.

And on the socialism-capitolism debate: in Russia in 1920 there was the worst famine in European history. Lennon enacted the “New Economic Policy” which de-socialized the farms of Russia. By 1927 Russia was the 5th largest EXPORTER of crops in the world. Let’s learn from history.
P.S.: Stalin actually killed all of the Russian farmers a fee years later because they were too “independent minded”.

]]> By: Howard Grimberg http://www.cleverdude.com/content/milton-friedman-on-the-rise-of-socialism-in-the-us/comment-page-1/#comment-59343 Howard Grimberg Wed, 20 Jan 2010 06:55:59 +0000 http://www.cleverdude.com/?p=1354#comment-59343 Correction: The USPS has not taken subsidies since 1982. It's an indepedant agency of the executive branch. It has a board of directors appointed by the president subject to senate confirmation just like a corporation. It is not too different than your average corporation nowadays. Correction: The USPS has not taken subsidies since 1982. It’s an indepedant agency of the executive branch. It has a board of directors appointed by the president subject to senate confirmation just like a corporation. It is not too different than your average corporation nowadays.

]]> By: Darryl http://www.cleverdude.com/content/milton-friedman-on-the-rise-of-socialism-in-the-us/comment-page-1/#comment-55630 Darryl Wed, 04 Nov 2009 00:52:27 +0000 http://www.cleverdude.com/?p=1354#comment-55630 socialist or free. that's the question. socialism is adopted as a means of controlling production and what is done with the production by means of legislation and taxation. In reading the comments here in favor of socialism it only shows how complacent we have become and that the underpinnings of socialism are so dark the not even Friedman would get into it. Friedman was agnostic and socialism is atheist. one of the reasons socialism gains any type of acceptance at all is because is seems that if you don't mention god we can all get along. well socialism is what you do in the absence of your inalienable rights , a little something mentioned in the constitution. so in conclusion, if something denies or takes ownership of your inalienable rights its unconstitutional. socialist or free. that’s the question. socialism is adopted as a means of controlling production and what is done with the production by means of legislation and taxation. In reading the comments here in favor of socialism it only shows how complacent we have become and that the underpinnings of socialism are so dark the not even Friedman would get into it. Friedman was agnostic and socialism is atheist. one of the reasons socialism gains any type of acceptance at all is because is seems that if you don’t mention god we can all get along. well socialism is what you do in the absence of your inalienable rights , a little something mentioned in the constitution. so in conclusion, if something denies or takes ownership of your inalienable rights its unconstitutional.

]]> By: joe http://www.cleverdude.com/content/milton-friedman-on-the-rise-of-socialism-in-the-us/comment-page-1/#comment-31275 joe Sat, 15 Nov 2008 08:04:14 +0000 http://www.cleverdude.com/?p=1354#comment-31275 yup you're right, laissez faire capitalism is wonderful. just look at what it stands for: maximizing profits. more profits = more jobs. right?...or wait, more jobs for who? you maximize profits by laying off american workers and exporting them to asia. and you know what, laissez faire actually gives companies more incentives to do so: NO TARIFFS! so therefore you get to save money by having chinese people work for ya, and at the same time you don't even have to pay taxes for that wonderful deed! well you know what... at least prices will be lowered since theyre paying people so much less to do the work..thats the reason they give us right? well look around my friends, whats cheap? what the fuck is cheap? so we got prices UP, Employment DOWN, wages DOWN, where is this tax cut money going to??? PROFITS. it's NIEVE to believe in trickle-down economics, not STUPID. people, when enough companies do this, consumer demand is near non existent, because well, consumers dont have money to spend, because well, they lost their job to an asian. or because well, while wages are going down, cost of living is going up. thats why so many people are uninsured, thats why so many people are getting foreclosed on, thats why weve seen the biggest drop in retail sales in u.s. history yup you’re right, laissez faire capitalism is wonderful. just look at what it stands for: maximizing profits. more profits = more jobs. right?…or wait, more jobs for who? you maximize profits by laying off american workers and exporting them to asia. and you know what, laissez faire actually gives companies more incentives to do so: NO TARIFFS! so therefore you get to save money by having chinese people work for ya, and at the same time you don’t even have to pay taxes for that wonderful deed! well you know what… at least prices will be lowered since theyre paying people so much less to do the work..thats the reason they give us right? well look around my friends, whats cheap? what the fuck is cheap? so we got prices UP, Employment DOWN, wages DOWN, where is this tax cut money going to??? PROFITS. it’s NIEVE to believe in trickle-down economics, not STUPID. people, when enough companies do this, consumer demand is near non existent, because well, consumers dont have money to spend, because well, they lost their job to an asian. or because well, while wages are going down, cost of living is going up. thats why so many people are uninsured, thats why so many people are getting foreclosed on, thats why weve seen the biggest drop in retail sales in u.s. history

]]> By: Shawn http://www.cleverdude.com/content/milton-friedman-on-the-rise-of-socialism-in-the-us/comment-page-1/#comment-30973 Shawn Mon, 27 Oct 2008 14:04:49 +0000 http://www.cleverdude.com/?p=1354#comment-30973 @Frank... The survey of economists you point to is very partisan. Just look at the politics of the economists surveyed. Of course Obama is going to get a better score than McCain in that pool. @Frank…

The survey of economists you point to is very partisan. Just look at the politics of the economists surveyed. Of course Obama is going to get a better score than McCain in that pool.

]]> By: Frank http://www.cleverdude.com/content/milton-friedman-on-the-rise-of-socialism-in-the-us/comment-page-1/#comment-30970 Frank Sun, 26 Oct 2008 22:03:28 +0000 http://www.cleverdude.com/?p=1354#comment-30970 deepali: lets see what the economists think: http://media.economist.com/images/20081004/CUS955.gif deepali:

lets see what the economists think:

http://media.economist.com/images/20081004/CUS955.gif

]]> By: Frank http://www.cleverdude.com/content/milton-friedman-on-the-rise-of-socialism-in-the-us/comment-page-1/#comment-30969 Frank Sun, 26 Oct 2008 22:01:59 +0000 http://www.cleverdude.com/?p=1354#comment-30969 CD: "who had majority power in Congress? Who makes the laws? The prez can only veto or suggest legislation." Let's not forget that the Republicans blocked more bills in this congress than any congress in the history of the US. So what policies have the Democrats pushed through that undid all the wonderful things Bush and the GOP has done for the country these last 8 years? CD:

“who had majority power in Congress? Who makes the laws? The prez can only veto or suggest legislation.”

Let’s not forget that the Republicans blocked more bills in this congress than any congress in the history of the US. So what policies have the Democrats pushed through that undid all the wonderful things Bush and the GOP has done for the country these last 8 years?

]]> By: deepali http://www.cleverdude.com/content/milton-friedman-on-the-rise-of-socialism-in-the-us/comment-page-1/#comment-30939 deepali Thu, 23 Oct 2008 21:21:01 +0000 http://www.cleverdude.com/?p=1354#comment-30939 There are clearly no economists in this argument, here, if all we can talk about is socialism and capitalism (and at that, as if each is a single entity without variation). ;) Also, I should like to point out that it's not good to mix up government and economic systems, even if they are very intermingled. Communism and socialism are not interchangeable concepts. I kind of find this argument to be pointless, in some ways. We have yet to see a *real* capitalist or socialist system at work, so it's hard to say which is better. All we've ever really experienced is oligopoly. I will go out on a limb and say it kind of sucks. :) But as for Friedman's article - he seems to be a big fan of deregulation. But yet, in which industry have we seen it successfully occur? I'm going to posit a different theory. Inefficiencies are not due to the type of economic system, but to problems of scale. Some things work better at the state-level than the national level. Oh, and USPS is technically a quasi-independent service, not a government agency... There are clearly no economists in this argument, here, if all we can talk about is socialism and capitalism (and at that, as if each is a single entity without variation). ;) Also, I should like to point out that it’s not good to mix up government and economic systems, even if they are very intermingled. Communism and socialism are not interchangeable concepts.

I kind of find this argument to be pointless, in some ways. We have yet to see a *real* capitalist or socialist system at work, so it’s hard to say which is better. All we’ve ever really experienced is oligopoly. I will go out on a limb and say it kind of sucks. :)

But as for Friedman’s article – he seems to be a big fan of deregulation. But yet, in which industry have we seen it successfully occur?

I’m going to posit a different theory. Inefficiencies are not due to the type of economic system, but to problems of scale. Some things work better at the state-level than the national level.

Oh, and USPS is technically a quasi-independent service, not a government agency…

]]> By: chris http://www.cleverdude.com/content/milton-friedman-on-the-rise-of-socialism-in-the-us/comment-page-1/#comment-30930 chris Tue, 21 Oct 2008 20:57:19 +0000 http://www.cleverdude.com/?p=1354#comment-30930 hey shawn, i am confused how you can say that there is no innovation because of socialism? united states' only real source of innovation is in the medical drugs field....which is solely supported by the govt's funding. if you look at our asian brother and sisters, a lot of those countries are communist, which is bastardized socialism. lots of innovation going on there. europe...your stats may be wrong or right...but the united states is at 6.1% 21 countries in europe are at or below that rate. also, evil cuba and china are below the united states 6.1 ...so is canada and mexico. hey shawn,

i am confused how you can say that there is no innovation because of socialism?

united states’ only real source of innovation is in the medical drugs field….which is solely supported by the govt’s funding.

if you look at our asian brother and sisters, a lot of those countries are communist, which is bastardized socialism. lots of innovation going on there.

europe…your stats may be wrong or right…but the united states is at 6.1% 21 countries in europe are at or below that rate.

also, evil cuba and china are below the united states 6.1 …so is canada and mexico.

]]> By: Shawn http://www.cleverdude.com/content/milton-friedman-on-the-rise-of-socialism-in-the-us/comment-page-1/#comment-30928 Shawn Tue, 21 Oct 2008 19:05:47 +0000 http://www.cleverdude.com/?p=1354#comment-30928 The comment about bailouts vs. allowing failures is absolutely right on. The problem is, that government got involved...whenever government gets involved (i.e. a bailout), it doesn't allow the survival of the fittest. Why are we constantly bailing out the auto industry. We aren't giving Toyota or Nissan, etc big bailouts? GM, Chrysler and Ford need to get their acts together. Their products suck. Socialism is bad. It takes away the risks of failure, but it also kills the rewards of success. Why has this country/world become more and more stagnant in terms of breakthroughs? It seems like everything "new" is just a rehash/rebranding of something old. There is no true innovation going on. And, you can almost undoubtedly blame that on the shift of every major country towards socialism. Countries is Europe are much more socialist than we are. Yeah, they provide universal healthcare (doesn't work), but they have some of the highest taxes. In turn, they have a much higher unemployment rate than here in the US. There needs to be some govt intervention to protect consumers from abuse, but consumers are pretty good at that when given choices. The comment about bailouts vs. allowing failures is absolutely right on.

The problem is, that government got involved…whenever government gets involved (i.e. a bailout), it doesn’t allow the survival of the fittest.

Why are we constantly bailing out the auto industry. We aren’t giving Toyota or Nissan, etc big bailouts? GM, Chrysler and Ford need to get their acts together. Their products suck.

Socialism is bad. It takes away the risks of failure, but it also kills the rewards of success.

Why has this country/world become more and more stagnant in terms of breakthroughs? It seems like everything “new” is just a rehash/rebranding of something old. There is no true innovation going on. And, you can almost undoubtedly blame that on the shift of every major country towards socialism.

Countries is Europe are much more socialist than we are. Yeah, they provide universal healthcare (doesn’t work), but they have some of the highest taxes. In turn, they have a much higher unemployment rate than here in the US.

There needs to be some govt intervention to protect consumers from abuse, but consumers are pretty good at that when given choices.

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